Comments on: Student who is punished to stand outside freezes to death http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/ Stories of China Mon, 06 Sep 2010 13:54:04 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: The Morningstarr* - School principal let lad freeze to death http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6816 The Morningstarr* - School principal let lad freeze to death Mon, 04 Jan 2010 18:05:26 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6816 [...] School principal let lad freeze to death You can see how comfortable he looked. Student who is punished to stand outside freezes to death | ChinaHush __________________ The Morningstarr* is like Fortean Times for deviants How can you not love [...] [...] School principal let lad freeze to death You can see how comfortable he looked. Student who is punished to stand outside freezes to death | ChinaHush __________________ The Morningstarr* is like Fortean Times for deviants How can you not love [...]

]]> By: hardyandtiny http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6667 hardyandtiny Thu, 31 Dec 2009 08:52:42 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6667 the state is not going to charge the teacher with a crime? the state is not going to charge the teacher with a crime?

]]> By: Dr. Jones Jr. http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6658 Dr. Jones Jr. Thu, 31 Dec 2009 04:25:59 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6658 I agree that some of the responses above seem tone-deaf. I imagine this sort of lashing-out is just as instinctive and thoughtless as when a fenqing becomes defensive over mild criticisms. Neither response is constructive. We can see many things in this story to be dissatisfied with: a step-father willing to be paid off for the death of a child; a teacher who breaks the traditional Confucian bonds of respect between teacher and student through his cruelty and carelessness; a student who has not the strength of will or bravery to come back inside when a punishment reaches absurdity; a government that goes into overdrive only to contain a crisis, not to reform the system that leads to the crisis. The tragedy may or may not have to do with unique systemic faults in the Chinese system, but laying out blame in such a simplistic and seemingly spiteful manner (John, particularly) helps no one. It erodes the impact of more thoughtful, constructive criticisms, as Chinese inure themselves to receiving nothing but unqualified criticism from beyond their borders, and it tells us more about the speaker/writer's fears than it does about the tragedy at hand. Both sides are likely to close their ears. I guess it goes both ways: please do forgive us foreigners our fenqing, if we can forgive Chinese their fenqing. I hope that more thoughtful voices on either side can prevail. Speaking more directly about this case: a boy lays down his life, seemingly for no good reason. But now his tragedy then causes thousands, perhaps millions, of Chinese to consider the meaning of "authority" and "teacher", whether or not those with titles and authority should be given the respect and obedience one gives a parent, if such respect has not been earned through actions. The article, a translation from Chinese, says as much. Societal change and reform is as much a part of 'developed' country status as economic growth is; but despite whatever obstacles the government may throw in the way of such reform, it would be short-sighted to assume that the Chinese people are incapable of evolving their society... with or without the aid of a recalcitrant government. I agree that some of the responses above seem tone-deaf. I imagine this sort of lashing-out is just as instinctive and thoughtless as when a fenqing becomes defensive over mild criticisms. Neither response is constructive.

We can see many things in this story to be dissatisfied with: a step-father willing to be paid off for the death of a child; a teacher who breaks the traditional Confucian bonds of respect between teacher and student through his cruelty and carelessness; a student who has not the strength of will or bravery to come back inside when a punishment reaches absurdity; a government that goes into overdrive only to contain a crisis, not to reform the system that leads to the crisis.

The tragedy may or may not have to do with unique systemic faults in the Chinese system, but laying out blame in such a simplistic and seemingly spiteful manner (John, particularly) helps no one. It erodes the impact of more thoughtful, constructive criticisms, as Chinese inure themselves to receiving nothing but unqualified criticism from beyond their borders, and it tells us more about the speaker/writer’s fears than it does about the tragedy at hand. Both sides are likely to close their ears.

I guess it goes both ways: please do forgive us foreigners our fenqing, if we can forgive Chinese their fenqing. I hope that more thoughtful voices on either side can prevail.

Speaking more directly about this case: a boy lays down his life, seemingly for no good reason. But now his tragedy then causes thousands, perhaps millions, of Chinese to consider the meaning of “authority” and “teacher”, whether or not those with titles and authority should be given the respect and obedience one gives a parent, if such respect has not been earned through actions. The article, a translation from Chinese, says as much.

Societal change and reform is as much a part of ‘developed’ country status as economic growth is; but despite whatever obstacles the government may throw in the way of such reform, it would be short-sighted to assume that the Chinese people are incapable of evolving their society… with or without the aid of a recalcitrant government.

]]> By: Notes From Xi'an http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6632 Notes From Xi'an Wed, 30 Dec 2009 14:35:38 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6632 This is a tragic story and since I heard about it last night it has been hanging over me but why do people think this story is justification to criticize a whole people, the Chinese people. What is this generalizing nonsense that is going on here, as Kay above says, it is tragic for Chinese and others alike. This one story is no justification to generalize about the moral nature of a whole people- if that is ever possible. This is a tragic story and since I heard about it last night it has been hanging over me but why do people think this story is justification to criticize a whole people, the Chinese people. What is this generalizing nonsense that is going on here, as Kay above says, it is tragic for Chinese and others alike. This one story is no justification to generalize about the moral nature of a whole people- if that is ever possible.

]]> By: Kay http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6628 Kay Wed, 30 Dec 2009 10:12:11 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6628 Hi,Bill, the kid being frozen to death is really a tragic event not just for you, but more for us - Chinese people. We are sad as you while angrier than you - because it happened in our country, to our people. While objectively, it doesn't have that much relation to the development or progress achieved by China in the last 60 years. When we are developing, we can not deny there are many many problems accompanied. While when something wrong happened, if we can make it to public and tell more people it's wrong and should not happen again, it is a progress itself. I have no idea how outside or our government says about China's economic growth, army strength, or other things like ambition to be the powerful country in the world, it's not true as a common people lived in China, what we want is to live a happy life with health body, warm house and lovely friends, and help other people needed. That’s all. While every simple thing will be no longer simple when it involves politics and personal interest. For the fastest train with foreign technology, I'm also surprised. and I will check more info before I give my comment. Hi,Bill, the kid being frozen to death is really a tragic event not just for you, but more for us – Chinese people. We are sad as you while angrier than you – because it happened in our country, to our people. While objectively, it doesn’t have that much relation to the development or progress achieved by China in the last 60 years. When we are developing, we can not deny there are many many problems accompanied. While when something wrong happened, if we can make it to public and tell more people it’s wrong and should not happen again, it is a progress itself. I have no idea how outside or our government says about China’s economic growth, army strength, or other things like ambition to be the powerful country in the world, it’s not true as a common people lived in China, what we want is to live a happy life with health body, warm house and lovely friends, and help other people needed. That’s all. While every simple thing will be no longer simple when it involves politics and personal interest.

For the fastest train with foreign technology, I’m also surprised. and I will check more info before I give my comment.

]]> By: XiaoWang http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6621 XiaoWang Wed, 30 Dec 2009 05:19:43 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6621 It actually makes sense. The teachers hit the kid several times so obviously he is normally a guy the students fear. Anyway the kid went into some sort of drain outside to shelter from the cold wind and snow but didn't dare to go back inside. Unfortunately inside was probably just as cold as outside but it felt more comfortable so the kid likely thought he was much better off inthere. Btw this story lends credibility to the often heard claim here in China that stepparents don't give a rats ass about their stepchildren. This guy seemed perfectly ok with the 200.000 kuai (the max compensation for deaths here though he probably settled for less) he got from the killing of his wife's son. Disturbing. It actually makes sense. The teachers hit the kid several times so obviously he is normally a guy the students fear. Anyway the kid went into some sort of drain outside to shelter from the cold wind and snow but didn’t dare to go back inside. Unfortunately inside was probably just as cold as outside but it felt more comfortable so the kid likely thought he was much better off inthere.

Btw this story lends credibility to the often heard claim here in China that stepparents don’t give a rats ass about their stepchildren. This guy seemed perfectly ok with the 200.000 kuai (the max compensation for deaths here though he probably settled for less) he got from the killing of his wife’s son. Disturbing.

]]> By: Kay http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6615 Kay Wed, 30 Dec 2009 04:13:13 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6615 Maybe it's related to the relationship between teacher and student. Sometimes, in the mind of students and their parents, teacher is very much important and has unique authority, so it’s possible for this pitiful kid to stand outside until lost his consciousness to death. Of course another probably important factor is this teacher is so ferocious that the kid is afraid of the consequence of run away. Maybe it’s related to the relationship between teacher and student. Sometimes, in the mind of students and their parents, teacher is very much important and has unique authority, so it’s possible for this pitiful kid to stand outside until lost his consciousness to death. Of course another probably important factor is this teacher is so ferocious that the kid is afraid of the consequence of run away.

]]> By: Mike G. http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6579 Mike G. Tue, 29 Dec 2009 19:44:34 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6579 So, this kid just stands outside until he dies?! Was this some Quonset hut in the Antarctic or was it in a city in China? My question is, why would an otherwise healthy kid with all of his facilities (?), not seek refuge in a nearby house or business? It seems very strange to me. So, this kid just stands outside until he dies?! Was this some Quonset hut in the Antarctic or was it in a city in China? My question is, why would an otherwise healthy kid with all of his facilities (?), not seek refuge in a nearby house or business? It seems very strange to me.

]]> By: Bill Rich http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6571 Bill Rich Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:21:23 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6571 Being frozen to death is a comfort Chinese can look forward to. Great for them. We must congratulate the Chinese people for their progress since their opening, reforming and developing in the last 60 years. Great job. Well done. Now that Chinese don't have a conscience to bother them, I expect to see even greater things to happen. The total collapse of moral enable the Chinese to do all things unthinkable, and unprecedented. In additional to the fastest train built with foreign design, jet fighters with engines from Russia, there will be even better things to come. Being frozen to death is a comfort Chinese can look forward to. Great for them. We must congratulate the Chinese people for their progress since their opening, reforming and developing in the last 60 years. Great job. Well done. Now that Chinese don’t have a conscience to bother them, I expect to see even greater things to happen. The total collapse of moral enable the Chinese to do all things unthinkable, and unprecedented. In additional to the fastest train built with foreign design, jet fighters with engines from Russia, there will be even better things to come.

]]> By: meerkat- http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6566 meerkat- Tue, 29 Dec 2009 12:44:00 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6566 This is one of those stories where the absurd is at such high levels, you know it's real. This is one of those stories where the absurd is at such high levels, you know it’s real.

]]> By: John http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6561 John Tue, 29 Dec 2009 09:44:53 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6561 This is pitiful, and proves that China has a loooong way to go before it can truly call itself a "First World Country" PATHETIC behavior on the part of the teacher. This is pitiful, and proves that China has a loooong way to go before it can truly call itself a “First World Country”

PATHETIC behavior on the part of the teacher.

]]> By: Doug http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/comment-page-1/#comment-6553 Doug Tue, 29 Dec 2009 02:38:29 +0000 http://www.chinahush.com/2009/12/28/student-who-is-punished-to-stand-outside-freezes-to-death/#comment-6553 Without consequences, what motivations do the wicked have to behave morally? Life is truly cheap in China. Without consequences, what motivations do the wicked have to behave morally? Life is truly cheap in China.

]]>